Club-S12.org

Club-S12 Community => Announcements => Topic started by: Arro on 02:39:07 AM / 27-May-10

Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Arro on 02:39:07 AM / 27-May-10
FYI, I've been gone, dealing with finals, but this was brought to my attention tonight, and I knew it would head there eventually, because sometimes people set aside good sense.

Look, I like what Matt Castle's doing on his blog site. It's good stuff. He knows I approve of what he's done there.

I don't even mind the occasional thread in Coffee shop discussing something on his S12 blog.

However, we don't need to turn Club-S12's forum into a regular advertisement for his blog site. I know a few of you have Matt's logo and a link to his S12 blog in your signatures, and that's ok too. But I don't need to see multiple links to articles on his site in your signatures, nor do we need to announce on THIS site every time THAT site creates a new entry. Why?

Because if anyone wants to go read and keep up with his blog, you can all GO there and DO so, like I do. We don't need to be constantly updated here. Ben and I respect his site, but we don't need a regular update on its goings on. That's why you just GO to the site and read the damn content lol.

I'm not removing links in sigs to his main site. Like I said, I personally support his efforts. But if you have links to articles or whatever, I'm removing them. If you keep posting "updates" for content on his site, I'm removing that, too. And if you have a problem with that, you can ask Matt what he thinks and, if he has a problem with that (which based on previous conversations with him, he will not), he knows how to get ahold of me.

Again, this ain't about S12silvia, it's about beating it to death. We're all grown-ups here. People know about the site. All the articles have COMMENTS provisions, where you can all discuss what's there. So discuss S12silvia articles on S12silvia, ok? I mean once in awhile I could understand. But we're not an extension of Matt's site, any more than his site is an extension of ours.

Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Arro on 02:53:31 AM / 27-May-10
Colin I see you writing in this thread for a few mins now, better not be a book
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Xano on 02:54:41 AM / 27-May-10
Just wanted to add, as Arro used s12silvia as an example, that this goes for any site.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Draconis on 03:03:24 AM / 27-May-10
Sweet, nice to know that in your haste to edit my signature, you deleted my personal blog link, personal CarDomain link, and a photographer's link with whom I work with.  My sig. was only concerned with s12s in print.  That included Keith, who's Reader's Ride has been lost on these forums for quite a while.  Or even the link to my personal foray into printed materials that is about three years old.

I can understand about the thread I started... Probably should have thought about finding Markus' thread and throwing it up there since it is his car and such.  I figured it would be cool to see another S12 besides Henry's that made a feature.

Also, by glancing at the thread that I was sent an IM to while doing homework, nice to see that you are specifically looking to me amongst whatever else you may be observing.  I mean after all, I was the one who had several links to S12Silvia.com in my sig. and posted that thread.  I actually debated about posting it.  I guess it did turn out as my first inclination.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Arro on 03:15:11 AM / 27-May-10
Yep, you were indeed the inspiration for this thread, dude. Not really hiding that fact. And yep, I did edit your sig. Not really hiding that fact, either. If I accidentally deleted something other than the list of articles, you and I both have seen the smallish window for editing sigs, and with all that web code, it's no wonder I overshot. Sorry bout that. Anyways it's not like you can't put a link to your own personal articles. You can! You should. But that's all. You don't need to chronicle all the articles on another site. Or even on this one.

I'm not actually singling you out really. You did that. Anyways I took care of it, right?

Just understand the reasons stated above, play fair, and don't stress over it. Matt and I, again, are on the same page.

Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Draconis on 04:35:00 AM / 27-May-10
You know as well as I, you can single anyone out without actually doing it.  This stuff has been going on before as people have changed their signature for their mood, particular thought process, or whatever behooves them.  You singled me out by stating it publicly and not pmming me telling me to change my sig. due to your post that stared this thread.  You were on IM, have my number and all that good stuff that you had access to discuss it with me privately without posting a reply calling me by name.

You have been able to go through my profile enough before to single out individual parts of it, so the whole bit about not being able to see well... I guess it depends on what tool you were using at the time, I feel it was more of what was easier knowing that I can replace the links of my choice 'within' the guidelines.

I far from stress over it.  I have other things to stress over.  Reason why it took me so long to write my first reply and so long for me to get back to you.  Playing fair?  Tell me who one here has ever truly played fair?  I can tell you, those who have been most active in some way or another do not play fair.  It is human to be biased.  It has been seen from many angles from many individuals time and again.

All I did was put links to only those S12s that were in print: Ben D, Keith, me, Henry, and now Markus.  Each have access to being downloaded.  As far as I'm aware, Ben D's, Keith's, nor Markus' were unavailable on this site.  If you dig far enough you may be able to find mine, if the hosted pictures are still there.  Henry's... you sort of have to use links to other sites in order to obtain a full copy of his.  All in all, I think my signature was rather benign and gave a shout-out to all those S12s that are held as inspiration to many without needing to dig through a forum to find.  If I did it right, I was within signature regulation size... low content so doesnt each up bandwidth or slow down processing... nothing really that offensive to anyone really.

But go for it.  Fits the pattern.  By the way, from what I was aware, a discussion had to do more with freedom of content within signatures without the normal/assumed profanity and such... but it is your site so you do have final say.

*edited to fix multiple gross spelling mistake.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Arro on 04:55:04 AM / 27-May-10
It wasn't a previous rule, it's just a common-sense thing. And yeah, Matt basically said it shouldn't be a big deal unless it's over the top. And I told him, it isn't a big deal if someone links to his or any site in their sig, unless it was over the top. Which yours in particular was.

Anyways whatever, it's what I decided. Matt isn't taking offense at it. Nor should he.


Edit: removed the useless posts from this thread.

Edit #2: and telling me "fits the pattern", Colin you might as well told me to eff off lol. Don't play with me. Be a man and don't use dramatic phrases like some of the people on here... don't hint at shit. If it had been someone else doing something excessive, I would have done the same thing. I can't make a rule for common sense, you should have known that listing a half dozen links to the same site in your sig was dumb. You're a smart guy, you should have known better. Anyways, there's no "pattern" other than Arro gets annoyed when he sees someone isn't using common sense.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: celestialsilvia on 11:36:49 AM / 27-May-10
Its kinda like posting links to articles on jalopnik or speedhunters. Either you read them or you don't (you should) but don't need an update on everything going on over there. This is a pretty hard and fast rule on my celica site
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Draconis on 02:49:44 PM / 27-May-10
Well, I can say that not everything was updated on this site.  Very few in fact.

But as far as your comment about your Celica site, it apparently depends on the site's leaders.  I do know that on several of the Skyline sites I frequent quite a bit all have bits from the GTR Blog on their front page.  From what I can tell, it's an automatic update as well.  I know some even have updates with news concerning Nissan Co.  But as was stated by Arro above, ix nay on the excessive discussion.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Arro on 03:05:18 PM / 27-May-10
I'm not including it in the rules because I think it's common courtesy to a community to not do that. From the handful of PM's I got, apparently I'm not the only one. Although I wish those of you who thank me in PM's would just man-up and post your opinions here
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: David B on 03:18:47 PM / 27-May-10
why? are you jeeloususus>?
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: kyskater on 03:27:45 PM / 27-May-10
i dont mean to sound like a ass hole but i personally think that if a link contains information that could be useful to other members then it should be posted and thank the poster for the info..... instead of creating another "useless drama" thread like this..... i mena that is just my take on it
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: David B on 03:29:21 PM / 27-May-10
its a damn sig. i dont see the issue. if anything seeing some other links will make users like s12's more imo. w/e

i like gay porn. but i dont post that in my sig links. ISNT THAT ENOUGH FOR YOU ARRO!
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: demonic s12 on 06:15:20 PM / 27-May-10
Quote from: David B
its a damn sig. i dont see the issue. if anything seeing some other links will make users like s12's more imo. w/e

i like gay porn. but i dont post that in my sig links. ISNT THAT ENOUGH FOR YOU ARRO!

Lol

Well said
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Umai Naa on 07:12:33 PM / 27-May-10
My only beef regarding signature content is the general quantity and size of images. Do they really need to be in the vicintity of 1000px X 500px?

Seriously Arro, if you're so hell-bent on controlling board content, then just shut the place down, and tell everyone to get lost. Same goes for anyone else that has decided to hop on the anti-AUS12/S12Siliva bandwagon.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Xano on 07:26:40 PM / 27-May-10
Quote from: Umai Naa
My only beef regarding signature content is the general quantity and size of images. Do they really need to be in the vicintity of 1000px X 500px?

Seriously Arro, if you're so hell-bent on controlling board content, then just shut the place down, and tell everyone to get lost. Same goes for anyone else that has decided to hop on the anti-AUS12/S12Siliva bandwagon.
I think you sir misunderstand whats going on, but oh well, thats your right.

As for AUS12, i dont know any of us that dislike it.  I know of a few people who dislike s12silvia (as we found out in methylprop's post a month or two ago).
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Umai Naa on 07:32:50 PM / 27-May-10
No, no. What I said about signature content is still relevent. Ie, it's not ok to rep certain things in some peoples' cases but we can put an entire desktop wallpaper as our signature. Go figure.

It basically highlights the stupidity of the concept of this thread.

I know there are still a few AUS12 'dislikers' out there. I remember us having to pointlessly go on justifiying our existance when AUS12 first appeared, because some people felt that this site should be the one and only.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Jay on 07:33:45 PM / 27-May-10
I only post in here to offer my uselessness of indifference.

Oh wait... I stepped in to say I hardly look at sigs anyways. So I didn't notice anything, much less for it to be any kind of a problem. I'm sure that goes the same for quite a few people on here too.

My 2 tacos

Quote from: David B
i like gay porn. but i dont post that in my sig links.

No homo? and sigged
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Xano on 07:53:26 PM / 27-May-10
I believe the size of the signature is restricted to 600x200, TOTAL size limited to 600x350. or something like that, so no you cant put large pictures either.

Quote
A V A T A R S & S I G N A T U R E S

Please comply with the following restrictions for your avatar and signature:

• Max. file size limit for avatar is 100KB (102,400 bytes). The physical size of avatars must not exceed 150px x 150px.
• Max. file size limit for signature images is 150KB (153,600 bytes) each. However, the combined file size of all the images must not exceed 250kb (256, 000 bytes). The physical size of signature images must not exceed 600px (width) x 200px (height) (please look below for maximum complete signature limitations)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v216/arrospeed/MAX_SIG_PIC_NEW.jpg)
• Do not post anything obscene in your avatar and/or signature.
• Max. dimension for signature is 350pixel (height) measured from the bottom of the bottom line, to the top of the red border. You will NOT be informed if your signature exceeds the max. dimension mentioned above. Your signature will be completely removed regardless of the situation.
Clarification: If your avatar / signature exceeds the max. limit, it will be removed completely without any notice. And as a result, you will receive an actual warning. Please take this seriously. An example of the maximum signature height:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v216/arrospeed/TOTAL_SIG_NEW.jpg)
• There is no limit on the number of graphics you can have in your signature, but they must be equal or less than the max. dimension and the max. file size limit.
• You are allowed to advertise your site and/or forums in your avatar / signature. However, excessive advertising will not be tolerated, please keep it short and to the point.
• As previously mentioned, please DO NOT attach random images or posting the same images repeatedly in your post. Violators will be given an actual warning.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Clowny on 08:04:23 PM / 27-May-10
Colin, I am sorry man.  I must have missed what magazine your car has been published in.  I know there is an article on it on s12silvia.com but I wouldn't exactly consider that "in print".
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Arro on 08:20:28 PM / 27-May-10
Umai, seriously man, you completely took it all out of context. If you're concerned about some kind of plot against Australia's S12 community (which is absurd, they grace our calendars nicely), then I'm just as concerned that a few people think I'm some kind of anti-aussie guy, or that I hate on AUS12 or S12silvia. Which is total bullshit.

We DON'T allow huge ass images in sigs, man. And if you know of someone here who has one, kindly PM myself or any other moderator and we will remove the image. Because as Xano just posted, IT'S NOT ALLOWED.

And as far as the australian S12 site, that discussion happened back in 03 man, and the original argument still holds that there are indeed regional differences in technical specs that require it. And for the record, it was a discussion over the UK forum, not over Oz, because it was the UK guys who were complaining that their CA18ET's were wired up differently at the ECU than North American cars.

So this idea that there was ever an opposition to an Australian S12 site is, well, basically crap. Not being an ass here, I'm just clarifying the history. I've been around long enough to know.


Back to the subject. We do not allow pictures taller than 200 pixels. And we don't allow the overall size of the signature (INCLUDING links and text) to exceed much more than that. So you can call this stupid or not. Point is, I don't need -- or like, yes, I admit that -- to see people basically treating Club-S12 as an update site for other sites. I could understand once in awhile. Again, I'm not making this a new entry in the rule thread. I just think it's both common sense and common courtesy to this community.

And for the record -- restated what, over a dozen fawkin' times now? -- I LIKE MATT'S BLOG SITE. And I enjoy signing in and reading (and occasionally posting) on AUS12. I'm the first American here to PRAISE you guys, I remember my usual statement was something like "Nobody tunes a crazy-extreme S12 like the Aussies do".

So Umai -- chill out. Nobody (not me, for sure) is against Matt, AUS12, or S12Silvia. Quite the opposite.

I just don't need people treating our site like it's an update page for any of the other sites. If people want to read things there (and they should), they should just GO there (and they should!).

I mean seriously, tell me -- do you really think I'm against you guys down under? Seriously?

I have no idea what Matt really thinks, but to the best of my knowledge, he would say I'm not against anyone over there. Or anything going on there.

I have no idea what Colin thinks either, although if I were to GUESS, he was dissatisfied with things here. Do not forget he held a position of importance once. He left on his own, but as far as he's said, he felt it was because I never let him have his way. Would that affect how he portrays this forum or me personally? Probably, but who knows. So make of that what you will, if he's decided to give an opinion on what I supposedly think.

But I just told you here in this post what I really think. So take it from whoever you want. Or just get it from the source.

And Colin, you made it pretty obvious you don't really like things here, and would rather devote your time elsewhere. So then why are you here? Cuz if you're gonna be here -- and this is my personal opinion, not Ben's or anyone else's -- you might want to show a little more respect to the forum as an entity. Or just give up the ghost? I'm just tired of being portrayed as the bad guy because I do what has to be done, or because I don't ignore it when someone obviously intends insult on the forum or myself personally. And because I've given up on keeping things quiet, behind the scenes, or subtle. Screw that, tried it for a couple years and nobody appreciated that lol.

So it's all on the table now. With anything. Right? lol

Drama. Some of you got it bad. Get girlfriends, grow up a little, live life. This is a forum. There are rules. There are guidelines. And then there are expectations of courtesy -- to each other, or to the forum, or to other forums. Which is why Matt could have a link to any of his sites if he wanted, but Colin can't have five or six of them to the same site. To use Matt's own phrase, that's a bit "over the top".
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Candellan on 10:33:53 PM / 27-May-10
I'll offer my 2 pesos here & say that from an Aussie perspective there does seem to be a anti AUS12/S12silvia vibe on here. That other thread having a crack at Matty's site was pretty offputting, but each to their own opinion I guess. Having purchased a car from him I know he's a good bloke, I can't understand why anyone would hang shit on him.

I've been a long time member of both forums & have watched a lot water go under the bridge. If I don't like something I usually either correct a glaring error or leave it the hell alone.

Arro you are opinionated & often brash, it just seems to be your nature (which is also the general image of most Americans to me). Aussies are usually laid back but very patriotic.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Xano on 10:48:28 PM / 27-May-10
I'd say you are right on the basis of the U.S.'s  opinionated nature as a whole.  Personally I feel that its more than likely due to one of the basics the U.S. was founded upon, which would be Freedom of speech.  We exercise it as much as we can because at one point in our cultures history, we were unable to do so without fear of death, so due to that, its been ingrained into us that we have the right and that its OK to say what we feel necessary, rather than never mutter a word.

On the subject of s12silvia, it is NOT the same as AUS12, i see so far a few of you have counted it as the same entity.  I like the idea of Aus12 (and all other regional sites). S12silvia is not a regional site however, so I dont see how it could be taken as an anti-Aus12 thing in any way if people dont like that particular site..  I guess thats where MY confusion lies when reading some of the comments so far.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: TurboNotch on 11:07:57 PM / 27-May-10
Quote from: kyskater
i dont mean to sound like a ass hole but i personally think that if a link contains information that could be useful to other members then it should be posted and thank the poster for the info..... instead of creating another "useless drama" thread like this..... i mena that is just my take on it
+9001  if its not moving and doesn't eat bandwidth its not worth complaining about. lets all give a big hand for another useless bitching thread. its fine if you want to modify the rules Arro, you have that right, but rather than leaving this up for discussion and having things go the way they are, just tell us how its gonna be and close the thread. that way ppl just go "wtf?" and then shrug it off.


Quote from: Clowny
Colin, I am sorry man.  I must have missed what magazine your car has been published in.  I know there is an article on it on s12silvia.com but I wouldn't exactly consider that "in print".
he made readers ride in Modified a while back.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Arro on 11:17:13 PM / 27-May-10
Because most americans are indeed asswipes on the internet, I have to be brash and up-front. Trust me, if you try diplomacy with some people, they just take advantage of it. Many americans are unfair assholes, so I do what I must. I had a swiss friend who once said that America was a few billion assholes who somehow manage to make it work. That said, I love my country, I respect most other countries. None of this has anything to do with one country against another. And yes, Matt Castle is an upstanding guy. Didn't that get mentioned... oh, I dunno, like numerous times already?

Nobody goes on AUS12, S12Silvia, clubS12france, or any other site, constantly linking those sites to every big build thread we get here. It would seem to me to be in poor form. Now, if I had a link to my own build thread on here, sure, I'd put it in my sig on other forums. And right now, I have the Club-S12 address in most of my outer-forum signatures... but then again, I run this place, and if Matt or Umai had a link to either of his sites, I'd think it normal, too. But I don't have a half dozen links to here. Again, I find think that would be in poor form. Anyways, only ONE person here really did that. I just chose to use it as an example of what is not a good idea to do. I personally find that sort of behavior a bit of an affront to what we do here. Some agree, some don't. Whatever. At least I'm honest. I don't play nonsense games, I don't drum up accusations, I don't spread rumors. I just run the forum, the way I see is fair and yet respectful to everyone, and to the forum community as an entity. And I felt that the forum was getting slapped a little by one guy's excessive action. So I did something about it. I don't hesitate to right what I feel is wrong. Regardless of "politics" or whiners who would bother to find drama where I intend none.

And yes, I don't consider S12Silvia an "australian" site. Which is why I also find this "anti-aussie" idea to be pretty ill-conceived.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Praizewood on 11:27:18 PM / 27-May-10
I personally am a bit angry at matt. Yes matt if you read this!
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Draconis on 11:50:40 PM / 27-May-10
So now that this thread has become more than just simply one concerning signatures and such, I'll only address that which has been directed towards me.  Only fair I get to have a say.  Recalling last time something came up, I think the same situation came up.  The topic switched to me.  Sorry for the deviation from topic.

Quote from: Arro
I have no idea what Colin thinks either...

Well, dont guess.  You dont really know what I think.  Like in a conversation we had a while back, you even said "I guess I dont really know you."  That is truth.  There are so many things that have changed since the first time I met you.  I left for more than one reason and to say I left because "I didnt get my way" is a bit much.  And yes, again, you took my words and intents and conceptualized it in some manner that was counter.  As with the ordeal with the UK site.  I told you everything legit and as it happened.  You totally thought I was doing something and to the point where you really didnt trust what I said.  You then got on the UK site and confirmed and even acknowledged that what I was explaining and saying was legit.

Quote from: Arro
And Colin, you made it pretty obvious you don't really like things here, and would rather devote your time elsewhere.

I am hardly on here.  Not nearly as much as I used to be.  The most I really do is discuss potential RB swaps, sell/buy stuff or post something I feel is of note and interest.

Quote from: Arro
So then why are you here? Cuz if you're gonna be here -- and this is my personal opinion, not Ben's or anyone else's -- you might want to show a little more respect to the forum as an entity. Or just give up the ghost? I'm just tired of being portrayed as the bad guy because I do what has to be done, or because I don't ignore it when someone obviously intends insult on the forum or myself personally.

So I portray you as the bad guy now?  The little I do say, which has been very little but when brought up in threads such as this, is rather irrelevant.  I do not intend to insult the forum nor you.  Actually much of what I say does not pertain to you directly or specifically.  More of trends and overall arcs.  I've stated things of this nature quite a bit and several times you have later said I was right.

Quote from: Arro
And because I've given up on keeping things quiet, behind the scenes, or subtle. Screw that, tried it for a couple years and nobody appreciated that lol.

Another told you so I stated to you years ago.

Quote from: Arro
...but Colin can't have five or six of them to the same site. To use Matt's own phrase, that's a bit "over the top".

When I had only two links, one being Henry's, you took a stab at it because it concerned Henry as a person.  I told you that I wasnt worried if it was Henry or not.  I was just expressing S12s that were printed in some form.  That line wasnt there for any form of advertising, just publicizing some of the higher profile S12s that people may or may not know of.  By the way, this is not the only forum I had the sig. on.  But it is ironically the only site that seems to have gotten any fuss over it.

----------------------------------------------------------------
Edited with the below quote
The below was posted by Arro.  This same thread, page three, post #42.  

"Jay, I concede partially to what you said about asking privately... I did bring up the issue in private once before, but I phrased it as a "maybe you should change that" kinds thing... and then this happened and I went staight to here."

Well, you stated this and closed the thread in response to Jay.  Like I stated in my above paragraph, yes you did indeed talk to me via PMs.  However, it was not about excessive signature links or anything of the like.  It pertained specifically to a link that dealt with Henry and the decisions made with topics/links concerned with Henry.  So honestly, please dont say that the issue of my signature as a whole was of topic in our last conversation that concerning my signature.  I have the data to assert my claim.

Sorry for editing my own reply in order to comment on something that was said.  But this thread was closed without allowing me to elaborate on what was discussed between Arro and I.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Anyway, to get back to the topic, I thought it was clear when I said ix nay on the excessive discussion.  Sorry.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Arro on 11:59:58 PM / 27-May-10
I'm not changing what I said.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Xano on 12:04:13 AM / 28-May-10
Quote from: Draconis
But it is ironically the only site that seems to have gotten any fuss over it.

Anyway, to get back to the topic, I thought it was clear when I said ix nay on the excessive discussion.  Sorry.
Its the only site that its occured with since I've been on here, so that point is a bit null.  
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Draconis on 12:15:59 AM / 28-May-10
Quote from: Xano
Its the only site that its occured with since I've been on here, so that point is a bit null.

I'm talking about my use of signature content on this forum and others.  I understand your concerns while you've been on here.  But it wasnt like that when you first started.  But then again, I'm sure you dont remember the random stuff I've used in my sig over the past several years.  Nor do I expect anyone to.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Redneck on 12:44:25 AM / 28-May-10
Quote from: Arro
Nobody goes on AUS12, S12Silvia, clubS12france, or any other site, constantly linking those sites to every big build thread we get here.
This basically sums up what Arro's main point seems to be about the excessive advertising and I would fully agree. Its just overkill, like watermarking original Nissan advertisements for the s12.

(http://s12silvia.com/http://s12silvia.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/US_Turbo_Preview.jpg)
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Arro on 12:54:07 AM / 28-May-10
Why did they watermark an advertisement? Yeah I wasn't aware of that, kinda odd, still doesn't change what I said.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Draconis on 12:57:16 AM / 28-May-10
Redneck, that exact deal was brought up in a previous thread.  Putting the blog's logo on a picture is quite standard.  It's far from abnormal for a blog under blog guidelines.  As for excessive advertising, this is the first someone posted that up here.  Much of what is on S12Silvia remains on S12Silvia.

Anyway, if you all want to discuss S12Silvia.com, nuances between AuS12 vs CS12 or whatever, have at it unless a mod/admin closes this thread.

All I know is that this thread has def. blown up into many encompassing concerns people have in general.  All I know is that I was not meaning to advertise for S12Silvia beyond the logo in my signature.  My links to multiple S12s that are in print form somewhere in the world was only for promoting S12s.  But that was deemed excessive since it ties too closely to S12Silvia.com and that apparently there is no need.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Jay on 02:05:40 AM / 28-May-10
I have a few comments to say, mainly to preserve my integrity as a human being, as I feel I can offer something.

I have followed this thread very closely... Sadistically enough, I enjoy watching social engineering unfold between people and groups. This thread has without a doubt, become extremely loaded.

To the Aussies:
Nobody was causing any Ill intentioned diplomacy against AUS12. This is from what I can tell an old subject that is being begrudged about for far too long. Quite frankly, I've used Aus12 as a valuable resource in many things. As an example, The "How to change wheel bearings on Live axles" comes to mind. Because it was a big help. Just like CS12, Aus12 has invaluable information that contributes to the S12 community. Mainly because you aussies do it bigger and better than 99% of us. As for the "Being hellbent on controlling board content", He is only hellbent on enforcing the rules set forth. I think everybody on the planet is guilty of this to any degree when it comes to their personal belongings. Of which this site is his.

To Arro and Draconis:
This is from an outside source, and is just a humble statement of my thoughts.
I understand where BOTH of you are coming from. I understand why you did what you did Arro. But, diplomatically speaking. Sometimes it's better to just ask somebody to do something. None of us know if you did or not. But I can guess that you didn't, otherwise it would have been mentioned by either one of you two. I understand that it is your site. And is dealt with according to your wishes. and as a respecting human, I have to accept your hospitality, so to speak, in any way you deem to give it. As should everybody else. I'm not an admin, and certainly not above anyone, period.
Draconis, this isn't slandered directly against you at all, just using this as an example to show off the rule that was set forth on, at the latest, 3/24/08. Which is as follows.

• You are allowed to advertise your site and/or forums in your avatar / signature. However, excessive advertising will not be tolerated, please keep it short and to the point.

I do not know how this could have been something to spite you in the recent nature when it was made over two years ago. Yes, I see your point of the promotion of the S12, and the linking of other peoples VERY nice cars. However, they are contained in the same relatively small and centralized area. This is easily seen as publicity/advertising, regardless of the intentions. If I had several threads to several places scattered amongst the internet, that is seen as okay by the forum guidelines. But to use the same amount, to point to relatively the same place, that has those same links, is not. I cannot really see how this is even an argument, as you signed and agreed to the TOS. Was it bothersome to any of us really? No, and probably not even to Arro, however he does need to enforce the rules that are set forth.

Maybe we need a true definition of amount. Rather than the loose term of excessive...

Yes, A few points were dead horses... Yes, I have much more I could say, but right now... flame suit on...
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Grant on 04:16:05 AM / 28-May-10
As jay stated above, I fully agree.

As arro stated, most americans are arrogant assholes. And I hate it. There's nothing like running a bar to see this point to its fullest.

I haven't noticed any "anti-aussie" feeling one here but I've only been here just over a year. Personally, I like seeing other people from other countries join this forum. I watch a lot of shows about other places in the world. The food, the people, and the cultures... They all fascinate me.

90% of australia's population lives along coast lines. And they have some strange and interesting food that I would love to someday try. I've had a friend move there a while ago.

Basically, from my point of view, I don't really see anyone bashing or hating on any one particular race or people. We are here because of our cars. Our unappreciated, pain-in-the-ass, "80's shit box", multipurpose, and no aftermarket cars.

I do believe the ad links were a bit excessive. No offense, but even I recognized the amount of links. But, am I no way, what so ever, bashing the site. I've been on there a few times, just to see how everything is progressing. And yes, I was because of the post. Which is cool. As long as it isn't multiple posts and links and blah blah. I think that thread should stay alive. I kind of, single thread, "hey, for those of you who don't know, this is going on" sort of thing. Like how we do with our own rides in the garage. Which no one has posted to my problem about! Lol

Anyways, this has already become an epic topic, that I know everyone will come to terms with, because that's how we do. CS12 is an international site that isn't going to hate on anybody because we all have the same passion about our S12.

Yeah, rant and ramble.... Can't we just feel the love?
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Castle on 06:13:33 AM / 28-May-10

This thread makes my head hurt.




Quote from: Praizewood
I personally am a bit angry at matt. Yes matt if you read this!


I love you too Omar.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Praizewood on 07:17:26 AM / 28-May-10
Why was some of my post deleted?
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Xano on 07:34:11 AM / 28-May-10
Quote from: Praizewood
Why was some of my post deleted?
Because what you had quoted, i did as a joke before everything kinda spiraled WAY negatively in this thread lol.  you can repost it if you want, I removed it during the big GRR bit happening earlier. just was hoping it'd be a subtle joke rather than quoted here haha.   Was why I PM'ed you askin ya to sign on msn
 
Actually here it is, i'll repost it for ya.  Was posted as a comment on henry's heartbreaker @ super street post on s12silvia.
Quote
One comment

   1.
      Killer_s12
      May 27, 2010 at 5:18 pm

      This car is amazing, I saw a link to it on http://Club-s12.org/ (http://Club-s12.org/)

Leave a comment
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: deadpirate on 11:15:55 AM / 28-May-10
This forum is beat to hell. People are so bored that they argue amongst themselves. Arro is so bored that he has to find things to dislike. Everyone here is just bored.

Maybe people should wrench on their cars or something, and probably work so they can stop being so poor.


Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: demonic s12 on 11:56:36 AM / 28-May-10
Quote from: deadpirate
This forum is beat to hell. People are so bored that they argue amongst themselves. Arro is so bored that he has to find things to dislike. Everyone here is just bored.

Maybe people should wrench on their cars or something, and probably work so they can stop being so poor.

thats why im richie rich.

i workie work
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: celestialsilvia on 12:03:32 PM / 28-May-10
Quote from: deadpirate
This forum is beat to hell. People are so bored that they argue amongst themselves. Arro is so bored that he has to find things to dislike. Everyone here is just bored.

Maybe people should wrench on their cars or something, and probably work so they can stop being so poor.

Its the only game in town bub. . . I think most of us DO have jobs, lives, and projects

I mean this entirely constructively, and am aware this forum is not other forums - but theres IS a 'boringness' about this site - cracking down too hard on linking to/posting up relevant/interesting links or answering EVERY question with "Use the Search Button" turns forums into dusty file cabinets of raw information instead of vibrant, alive resources and recreation
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Arro on 04:55:30 PM / 28-May-10
Jay, I concede partially to what you said about asking privately... I did bring up the issue in private once before, but I phrased it as a "maybe you should change that" kinds thing... and then this happened and I went staight to here.

Andrew... as always, you are our current crown Drama Queen. Every forum has one.

Quote from: deadpirate
This forum is beat to hell. People are so bored that they argue amongst themselves. Arro is so bored that he has to find things to dislike. Everyone here is just bored.

Maybe people should wrench on their cars or something, and probably work so they can stop being so poor.

And Deadpirate.... STFU and get out of our forum if you don't like it here. I'm far from "bored"... I've been buried in school (notice I haven't been on much recently) and I work. And have been working on two of my cars. And ripping and replanting lawn in the front and back yards. How about you? *lifting middle finger with a grin*

Enough has been said on here to support my thoughs on the original subject posted. This thread hurts my head as well, although I can't say if it's for the same reasons Matt has. Whatever.


Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: deadpirate on 05:14:17 PM / 28-May-10
Quote from: Arro
Jay, I concede partially to what you said about asking privately... I did bring up the issue in private once before, but I phrased it as a "maybe you should change that" kinds thing... and then this happened and I went staight to here.

Andrew... as always, you are our current crown Drama Queen. Every forum has one.
And Deadpirate.... STFU and get out of our forum if you don't like it here. I'm far from "bored"... I've been buried in school (notice I haven't been on much recently) and I work. And have been working on two of my cars. And ripping and replanting lawn in the front and back yards. How about you? *lifting middle finger with a grin*

Enough has been said on here to support my thoughs on the original subject posted. This thread hurts my head as well, although I can't say if it's for the same reasons Matt has. Whatever.

Shit man, did that hit home? You even used asterisks to describe your reaction, suffice it to say that the grin probably meant I was pretty close. The ripping and replanting is kinda TMI though. Seems like criticism isn't taken well on your end. I'm just pointing out some observations, this place has really changed for the worse from 07.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Arro on 05:18:45 PM / 28-May-10
hit home? How about I think you're just being a prick and call it out?

I've been here a lot longer than '07. Long before you. It's no better or worse than it was then. And I was gone for a couple years.... but it's still the same. So I don't know what you're talking about

The only nerve you hit is the troll meter in my brain. Like I said, STFU, or I will see you out. I take a hard stance on trolls.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: deadpirate on 05:23:08 PM / 28-May-10
Quote from: Arro

And I was gone for most of that.


Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: demonic s12 on 06:54:55 PM / 28-May-10
I'm hurt...
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: sam31183 on 08:31:53 PM / 28-May-10
.....wow....just....wow.....


you guys have got some issues here....and i am far to late to post anything relevant to this thread that hasnt already really been stated besides...well, maybe this. (taken out of context of course.)

No linked S12 content will be allowed in signatures. Welcome to the republic nation of club s12via.  

There was some talk about there being to much information or linked content in draconis sig....well, it was clearly organized and labeled as S12s in media print. If Arro had a problem with such content he shouldnt have suggested to colin that he he remove it like he did...he should have told him so as an admin....and then made up a rule based on said content....what arro did was really just randomly make up the linked content rule on the fly because of some vague signature law...and modified colins signature without warning. Does he have that right as an admin? Yes, he does. Does it look good on him? No. The way this thread has gone has also clearly singled colin out and arro's actions and it doesnt look good on him at all as an admin....it is his site...so he basically can do whatever the fuck he wants as an admin....but your going to break a couple eggs to make your omelette if you dont go about things in a certain manner...

to sum things up...i dont really agree with what decision was made, or in the way it was made. You clearly have every right to make the decision you have made as you are the admin...also, this is the only north american s12 site...so we all have step in line if we own an s12 and live in canada, usa, or god forbid mexico....but, some consideration should be made to the members of the forum.....but then again, it is your site so you can do whatever you want...

Thats my 2 cents...and this will most likely be my only post in this thread before it gets locked.

(if you re read your posts before you post you wont have to edit it for spelling errors...)
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Xano on 11:38:24 PM / 28-May-10
At the top of the forum guidelines post that is in nearly every major section, you'll see a line that says Posting here is not a right, its a privilege.  To that effect, we still try to be as fair as possible with what is done, but to an extent.  If someone else is intentionally stepping to the line of the rules but not past, just so he can whine and say "ohh but i didnt break a rule cmon!" (which in my opinion is EXACTLY what was done), it is OUR judgement call to do what is necessary, and personally, I think it was done properly.  

On a no offence meant note here, I think you should clear your mind of personal attachments to people you may live close to and see from time to time rather than being biased, and that is to ANYONE, not just the people who thus far have made me come to the conclusion that there are largely biased people here.  Let me put it this way, if Jay, or Matt (Wisconsin Matt) or anyone else ive met in person stepped out of line, I'd treat them the same as anyone else on here, even if it may upset them.  I know Arro does and will do the same.

Also, The rules clearly state that signatures that violate the rules will be removed without warning, and you may be issued an account warning.  Doesn't matter if you were an admin before, pushing the rules is breaking the rules.  This site IS boring lately, I'll admit that, but that is why we will be making some positive changes to it soon.  Both me AND arro have been extremely busy with real life stuffs such as school, job, and so on, so dont assume we are bored.  We'd preffer people to just chill out and use common sense, so we can breathe and not worry about whats going on as much.

Also, on the "north american" topic, this is the International site.  Always was, always will be.  But that was hashed out in a previous thread already, so that topic is null and will not be discussed further here.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Arro on 12:24:52 AM / 29-May-10
And for the record (or the pricks who don't read OR twist shit), nobody -- not even me -- is saying you can't have a link to S12 content.

You just can't have multiple links back to the same site.

Or can't you read, Sam?

Some of you are pitiful.
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: sam31183 on 12:31:35 AM / 29-May-10
I said i was probably not going to post on this thread again...but a rum and coke later and i am a little buzzed so i am going to say a word or two.....keep in mind, i am not super buzzed..

I acknowledge you guys have final say over everything that goes on here...and for some things you have to make a judgement call...but, i dont agree with the judgement as the rule is vague....but, all i can do is say my piece and move on.

My relationship with colin has little to do with wether or not i agree with the decision that was made...i went maybe 2 or 3 years without talking to him...i wouldnt say we are close by any means. We know each other, we have done business with each other, and we are located some what near each other. If it wherent for the s12...i am pretty sure we would have never met, and i am pretty sure we would have never spoken...he is a good guy, but i doubt we would get along for too long in the outside world...or maybe we would...idk.

Someone posted the rules earlier, and it was vague about what the rules where regarding signatures like colin's....it was a judgement call to say it didnt fit what you guys wanted. You are clearly within your rights to do whatever you want with it....but imho, he had good s12 related material posted up in a quick, easy to see, organized manner...he didnt even have a pic in his sig. Like I said, you guys are within every right you have as admins/owners of the forum for just going and editing his signature without warning....but it is kind of a dick move to do it without warning....

Yah, the whole international vs north american thing has been argued before....it just feels like with an auss12, uks12, s12france, s12 eastern europe, and s12sweden that this is the north american representation as this forum is mostly populated by north americans...maybe if you guys want to be truly international then an north american s12 site should be formed...sounds redundant though right?
Title: Excessive Site Links And Advertising In Signatures
Post by: Arro on 01:23:08 AM / 29-May-10
Edit: this was actually worthy of its own discussion...

http://club-s12.org/v3/index.php?topic=30290 (http://club-s12.org/v3/index.php?topic=30290)