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S12 Media & Build Projects => Build Projects => Topic started by: mrjacobwho on 11:59:56 PM / 26-Oct-10

Title: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 11:59:56 PM / 26-Oct-10
Hello! I just wanted to start a build thread so I could throw out my ideas and think easier. Hah I, as of now, have a 1986 200sx parked in my driveway with a knocking engine. I have stumbled across a cheap KA and figured it wouldn't be a bad engine. So, I'm waiting for the money to come around to start this. Tomorrow, I will most likely be taking out the ca18et and setting it aside for scrap. I'm trying to sell a 4.0L Jeep engine to get the Nissan running again.

My main goal of this build is to make medium-range power looking generally stock; the typical sleeper. Stock wheels, brakes, suspension; but a turbo'd ka. T3 top mount, 3" straight pipe, fmic, forged inners, the works. Wayyy later. First comes the stock ka, so bear with me.. Hah Pictures soon.

-Jake
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: Arro on 01:43:19 AM / 27-Oct-10
Just sad a CA18ET is dyin... but I can relate, it's just more practical to run with the KA.

Do yourself a favor and start off with a non-turbo KA, so you can enjoy the improved power, and the focus on suspension and other crap. A powerful engine aint shit without suspension to control it with. You can boost it later.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: Deezus on 04:04:06 AM / 27-Oct-10
Dont boost a stock ka.

Pop.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: fyneyoungstunna on 03:45:28 PM / 27-Oct-10
haha be like me and go Qr, 200 tq/hp out the box and very bosstable.  Ok im done spamming for the day.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 09:06:10 PM / 27-Oct-10
Hah ok, n/a for sure at first. If I were to do a turbo build, it would most likely be done in full. I made progress today! Got out the old CA.. Cleaning comes tomorrow. and then I think I'm scrapping the engine.. Unless anyone wants it! Hah It knocks and shuts off when the going gets tough. Buying the KA soon and then wiring begins... Whew! I'm off to work now! Hah Gotta love a night job.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: Arro on 12:28:53 AM / 28-Oct-10
Dont boost a stock ka.

Pop.

That's false. He can boost a stock KA, they do it all the time. The reason why I told him to hold off is so that he gets around to the rest of the car before embarking on a tuning project. But they boost stock longblocks all the time on ka-t.org.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: fyneyoungstunna on 12:37:49 AM / 28-Oct-10
wait you have a cadet that your gonna scrap?

dont do that, how much for all the stuff to turbo my ca20e( hey im swapping it anyways so minus well blow it up)?
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: Deezus on 12:42:38 AM / 28-Oct-10
That's false. He can boost a stock KA, they do it all the time. The reason why I told him to hold off is so that he gets around to the rest of the car before embarking on a tuning project. But they boost stock longblocks all the time on ka-t.org.

Dont fuckin tell me its false. You can go ahead and boost a stock ka and watch it pop in a week.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: Navy_Mech2 on 01:14:42 AM / 28-Oct-10
it is false. its been done/documented many times on ka-t.org just like he said, so long as you dont over-do it.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: Deezus on 01:21:45 AM / 28-Oct-10
You put a t25 and sr injectors on a stock ka its ganna pop.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: Nameless on 01:25:40 AM / 28-Oct-10
Ka24 are great for boosting, around 300 whp you will want to upgrade pistons they are the weak link. Hell there is people on ka-t.org running close to 400whp on stock motor for years now without a hitch....i wouldnt go that far, but a mild t25 or t28 with sr injectors (i would go with 550's for some head room myself and a front mount running enthalpy ecu tune, and you should be around 230 240 whp on 10 psi. It's is perfectly safe on a decent ka24. You may also want to upgrade to a z32 MAF because the stock one wont read past 260ish hp.

Deezus,  stop spreading lies, it helps no one. Go read up on ka-t.org do your research and have fun with your project. I agree with arro though get the ka in and work on your suspension, brakes, tires, make sure everything is in good working order and then build a turbo set up for it. Concentrate on one part of the project at a time, if you get ahead of yourself and start doing to many things the project will be in pieces and will never end up being finished. Good luck with it :)

Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: Redneck on 01:26:48 AM / 28-Oct-10
it is false. its been done/documented many times on ka-t.org just like he said, so long as you dont over-do it.

Don't mind Deezus. He is just salty because he got sold a ghetto rigged ka swap.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: Deezus on 01:46:01 AM / 28-Oct-10
Don't mind Deezus. He is just salty because he got sold a ghetto rigged ka swap.

^ Real Talk.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 10:50:14 AM / 28-Oct-10
Haha I understand pushing the limits. I have a friend who was running 17psi on a stock sr block. Why it is still running is beyond me.. S13 suspension for sure, then all forged inners and a top-mount t3. I could even get it bored just to increase the pre-boost power. Yeah, someone take this engine off of me! I need the wiring and stuff, but the turbo and both manifolds can go with it. Make me an offer! I live around Raleigh, NC.

Post Merge: [time]05:03:50 PM / 28-Oct-10 [/time]
OK! So, there were a few problems i ran into while removing the CA. One, I had to cut a power steering line. So I'll be making a trip to the junk yard soon enough.. It was the one that comes around to the front of the engine and screws in. I guess I missed it and started lifting the engine, it bent and cracked, so I cut it. Hah No biggie, cause I'll just get a new one. And two,  I'm really worried about the wiring.. Can someone give me a link to a good wiring guide? 86 mk1 ca18et to ka24de.

I also have to start tearing apart the Jeep! The whole suspension lift goes aside, tires and wheels aside, steel-braided brake lines aside too. The rest is for sale! I think the front axle asembly will be gone tomorrow. Engine and tranny soon as well. The rest, to the junker. Other than the drivetrain, that thing is a piece. [And this is directly related, I'm not just rambling.. This is how I'm getting the money for this project!]

So, what I need:
another power steering line $5?, ka $200 [wiring too], tranny $100, half-shaft $50, iunno? Hah

Post Merge: 01:43:05 PM / 28-Oct-10
HEY!! One of my friends brought up a great idea! and I'm sure it's been done.. Take the turbo from my CA, t25 I think? and put it on the KA. Find a manifold with the t25 flange [$100] and bolt it up! Same exhaust and everything. I'd just need a FMIC and the whole set-up including pipes, the intercooler itself, cutting, MAF, blow-off? Whew.. What do you guys think of that? KA24DE-T w/ Garrett t25. In the end, I want a larger top-mount, but this could be an interesting project. I could only run like 7 pounds though... Hah Oohh.. I may need a boost controller too.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: Deezus on 03:25:57 PM / 28-Oct-10
Pop.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: Redneck on 05:02:03 PM / 28-Oct-10
HEY!! One of my friends brought up a great idea! and I'm sure it's been done.. Take the turbo from my CA, t25 I think? and put it on the KA. Find a manifold with the t25 flange [$100] and bolt it up! Same exhaust and everything. I'd just need a FMIC and the whole set-up including pipes, the intercooler itself, cutting, MAF, blow-off? Whew.. What do you guys think of that? KA24DE-T w/ Garrett t25. In the end, I want a larger top-mount, but this could be an interesting project. I could only run like 7 pounds though... Hah Oohh.. I may need a boost controller too.

The ca18et has a t2 turbo. It is tiny even for the ca18et. The minimum size I would recommend for a ka24 is a t25g from an sr20det. They can be had for 100-150 bucks on average. If you do go ka-t just make sure not to cut corners with your fuel/timing management. The ka24 has n/a timing and needs to be readjusted for turbo timing. If you don't invest in proper engine management and tuning Deezus's repeated "pop" scenarios become reality.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: Nameless on 05:27:55 PM / 28-Oct-10
I would try and find a t28, doesnt run out of steam as bad as the t25. Check out http://www.rs-enthalpy.com/order.html   Great well known tuner will tune your ecu to your spec, all you have to do is send him your ecu :) works really well. I would also upgrade your fuel pump and injectors like previously stated.

If you dont do it right you will blow an engine no problem, just like any other engine.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 05:46:32 PM / 28-Oct-10
I'm gonna make sure to do it right! Non-turbo for now. Well, I picked up the wiring today, and I was wondering if I could have it almost fully wired before I even get the engine. Hah Soo.. I've seen the ca20 diagram, but I haven't seen the ca18 yet.. Yeah?
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: Deezus on 05:57:51 PM / 28-Oct-10
ca18 to ka is pretty much the same deal
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: turbos12 on 06:48:35 PM / 28-Oct-10
I live around Raleigh, NC.
 
im in Raleigh too!
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 08:40:25 PM / 28-Oct-10
I get paid tonight! When I wake up, I'm picking up the KA. Wiring begins tomorrow after I actually put the engine in the car. I did pick up all the wires today. Like, allll of them; even the dash, headlights and tail lights. Hah Tranny comes later... My CA is still on the lift. O.o It needs to be set on a pallet or something. Then, I'll be messing with the KA for a while now! I need an intake, exhaust, a power steering line, and now I find out that I need the pump as well.. I found a cheap driveshaft. :] Could it be running by tomorrow? Hmm..

Post Merge: 10:32:04 AM / 29-Oct-10
NC rules! Hah Anyway, I'm about to get the engine and start messing with it. I must find SOME type of wirng diagram.. I may try to use the one on here from a ca20 and just use a bit of intuition to figure out the rest. :] Updates later.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 12:07:24 PM / 01-Nov-10
To do list:

-understand & complete wiring with solder & shrink wrap
-find ka downpipe [mine was cut off..]
-buy cold air intake
-buy MAF?
-get ka bellhousing for my 'B' tranny
-put on hoses [I'm waiting for all the wiring]
-custom throttle cable mounting brackets [anyone?]
-possibly cut hood supports [if needed]
-tune-up!
-valve cover gasket [this one came to me when the valve cover came off by hand]

aaannd... I guess that's it. Hah :] There's probably more, but I just had to write it out to know it. Hah I'm stumped on wiring right now! So, that's where I am. I have to sit and read and then stare at my engine. Haha Updates to come....... And I can't seem to upload a picture!
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: Nameless on 12:32:07 PM / 01-Nov-10
you have s13 motor mounts to install right?
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 10:06:56 AM / 02-Nov-10
Yeah, they were still on the motor when i got it. Getting the wiring figured out too! I finally understand it.. Before, I went looking at the plugs and hesitated because they were different, but I finally found the guide where the wiring was right-on. I'm doing that today.

A few more things on the list...:
-buy power steering pump! [came without one]
-buy a power steering line [I cut one.. D:]
-put on alternator
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 01:57:12 AM / 08-Nov-10
So, I went to the junkyard yesterday. I found an auto s13 and a manual s14, both ka. I ended up checking both blocks to see if the bolt pattern matched up. Sure enough, I ended up taking it home. I did the bellhousing swap this morning, she's all sealed up. I got the old clutch and pressure plate today. The clutch was paper thin.. I compare it to my ca clutch and it was exact. Haha So; I used the s13 ka pressure plate on my s12 ca clutch inside of an s14 ka bellhousing [bolted to the s12's 71b tranny..] on an s13 ka24de. The transmission goes in tomorrow! As soon as I put fluid in it.. Is there manual transmission fluid? Or is it just gear oil? Sorry for the n00b question, but I've never taken apart a transmission before.. :]

heater hoses attatched, wires soldered [except on i think..], and I got a maf! Accomplishment. Wait til the ka actually powers the car... haha
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: BoOsT-HuNgRy on 11:18:55 AM / 08-Nov-10
gear oil use lucas or a nice synthetic .

as for the maf if you can get your hands on a z32 maf with pig tails use that also if you got the extra cash on hand pull the head off and buy ur self a nice metal head gasket and arp head studs. this will save ur ass in the long run when your ready to go from n/a to turbo. i have built a few ka-t's and i stand behind them 100%. ka-t is the way to go when your ready let me know ill make send you a pm of everything to build a reliable ka-t for under 2k and you'll spank sr's all day long. :)

cheers.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 01:05:23 PM / 08-Nov-10
Ok, cool. Thanks! I definately need this thing running sometime soon. Hah So, the ka-t part may take a bit. I figure that Ill do a full rebuild when the time comes to do a turbo build. All new....everything. Hah Forged parts, metal head gasket, 3" straight pipe, new radiator, fmic, high-flow intake plenum, and im thinking that the t28 bb from the s15 would handle like 400hp. Im looking for 350 or so anyway. I drove my friends z32, 300hp stock, and I decided that for a daily driver, that's plenty. Of course, drifting and racing brings tons of guys running upwards of 500hp, but im not building this for any of that. I want my s12 to be good on gas, but great if I wanted to stomp on the pedal. I plan on building a nissan v8 for taking to the strips. :] So, this isnt gonna be the fastest ka'd s12, but its gonna me mine!!

I was even considering a twin-charged setup on the v8, similar to the VW 1.4l tsi, small supercharger boosting low, pre-spooling the twin turbos[single on the tsi], then allowing the turbos to reach full capacity after a certain rpms. Wayyy later though... Im just dreaming and talking. I dont want to get in over my head quite yet!

I took some pictures! Theyll be up later.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: Deezus on 07:47:06 PM / 08-Nov-10
Pop.

300 horsepower in an s12 is ganna be a lot different than 300 in a z32 lol but itll be a sick mofo
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: Redneck on 08:03:04 PM / 08-Nov-10
I figure that Ill do a full rebuild when the time comes to do a turbo build. All new....everything. Hah Forged parts, metal head gasket, 3" straight pipe, new radiator, fmic, high-flow intake plenum, and im thinking that the t28 bb from the s15 would handle like 400hp. Im looking for 350 or so anyway.

300 horsepower in an s12 is ganna be a lot different than 300 in a z32

Exactly. Even with 250-300whp an s12 will be plenty fast, much more so then a heavy z32. Plus if you keep it under 300whp a rebuild is not necessary as long as your ka24de is in decent health (with proper tuning of course). Also, 400hp from the s15 t28 is probably not gonna happen. If your looking for 400hp a t3 or t3/t4 is a much more practical option.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 10:26:12 AM / 09-Nov-10
I have all of that to think about.. Main goal right now is to drive the ka. Transmission goes in today, because I found out that I couldnt do it by myself. :] hah I tried.. I think I'm just now discovering how short my s12 is. The tranny is way shorter than the s13, which means the wheelbase too. I kinda like it; it's more compact than stretched and flatened like the s13 hatch.

Oooh!! My frinds s13 just started moving under its own power. I was very excited to see this! I call the car a beater, but he loves it.. Haha Sr20det.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 09:37:59 AM / 11-Nov-10
I went shopping last night! Tune-up, different oils, coolant, belts, filters, clutch alignment tool. I still need to put together an air intake with the MAF, a filter and a 45 degree 3" pipe.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 05:03:21 PM / 25-Nov-10
Not much progress going on here lately. I started the swap knowing there was gonna be a lot of down time during. The controlling factor here is money. Haha But I've been working hard, trying to save. As for the progress to date; the transmission is in finally, the clutch aligned and it fit perfectly! What a frankenstein tranny.. The alternator and power steering pump went on fine with the belts and everything. I needed to ps pump because it was the tensioner pulley for the belt that also goes around the water pump/clutch fan pulley. I may just run it dry though? I plan to build another engine on the side and put it in later, so I figured that even if it would burn out the pump, I wouldn't need it later anyway.. As long as it doesn't seize?? What's the reccomendation here? Cause I don't much want to have to get the lines... I'm picking up and SR block soon too, to rebuild from the bottom up. :D
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 10:53:13 AM / 04-Feb-11
So, I'm finally getting back around to messing with this. Haha It's been a while.. Ok, hopefully by the end of today, I will have my hands on all the parts I need. 240sx cold air intake and power steering lines. Then, theres still a bit of work. There are 2 random plugs that need to be swaped, one is on the alternator and the other is right next to the oil filter, maybe the pressure regulator. Then I also need to attach the wires to the alternator and to the starter. Hah I just lacked the motivation to go out in the cold and finish all of that stuff and still not have it run. So, hopefully I'll be putting up a first start video within a week!! :]
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: turbo-s12 on 01:14:13 AM / 07-Feb-11
My friend boosted his ka that was all stock internals and got 430rwhp and it never blew it was TUNED right which most people don't do...just my two cents I will be boosting my stock ka....good luck with ur swap:)
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: VG30_S12 on 09:36:36 AM / 07-Feb-11
Says your in zebulon... I haven't seen the first s12 out there lol
If you need a hand I'm in the middle of my swap(got it running lol) and I'm in knightdale too
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 11:11:56 AM / 07-Feb-11
yep! thats cause it was only running for about 3 months before the ca18 popped on me. hah its almost there. im still waiting on a part in the mail.. i just picked up the main ps line, and im probably installing that today. plus the few plugs. bro, you shouldve said that a long time ago! haha everything is in, wiring is done [except the alternator plug..], and its just about time for a start up! i could probably start it today, the only thing i would be lacking is the air intake. so it would throttle body to nothing.. yay for safe mode! oooh.. a boosted ka still sounds nice. hah how far are you on yours anyway? i still havent put up any pictures.. haha lemme do that later today.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: VG30_S12 on 12:34:17 PM / 07-Feb-11
Its a SLOWWWWW process.. just got her fired last week but vacume leaks kept it from running worth a shit. would love to come check our toy out sometime ;) gotta get together when were both road worthy
I'm over by Watkins rd and old millburnie rd, near the fire department

Post Merge: 12:35:08 PM / 07-Feb-11
If ya need anything lml dood
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 04:42:20 PM / 08-Feb-11
ok, i know the area. hah itll probably be another few weeks.. ive got some other crap that needs my attention. yay for distractions. haha ill pm you or something when shes worthy!
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 01:35:28 PM / 24-Feb-11
Soo.. One of the fusable links got fried. It was the 'alt/nat battery' one. So, that fixed all my electrical crap, as everything had stopped working after the swap, which I found weird because with no engine in it I could still turn on the lights and radio. Hah I couldn't find a new one at any parts store around here, but I did find a fusable link wire. So I actually just took it apart and replaced that and soldered it. Come to think of it, that would probably also be the reason it was never sparking! I still have to rewire that one coil plug, wait for the ebay short-ram intake to come in, and still install that power steering line... Haha Hopefully I'm about done with the whole money aspect though..

p.s. I caught bronchitis or something.. So I haven't gotten out too much this week. Poo!!
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 11:36:52 AM / 26-Feb-11
This is turning out to be a bit more ghetto than I had hoped. Haha I finally got the power steering line on. I don't reccomend trying to use the s13 main line, I did, and it was very difficult. I had to reshape it, plus it runs around a different way.. But that part is done! Yay for a ka swap with power steering!! Everyone was telling me to delete it, but it's complete! Ohh, I also finally got the ebay air cleaner in. It's got all these red parts on it. Hah It looks so cheesy.. And now I found this nipple thats under the throttle body, right on top of the alternator, and it started dripping antifreeze. So, if I can even get to it, it's very cramped, I need to connect it up top I think..

Anyway, this is the to-do list: more fluids [power steering and gear oil for the tranny], figure out that coolant line, figure out the vacuum lines, fix the coil plug, and mount the ecu somewhere... I'm thinking about just buying some wire and extending it. It's probably worth it to get it out of the weather.

Post Merge: 09:16:13 AM / 27-Feb-11
Vacuum lines complete! :]
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: ka-tgazelle on 08:51:28 PM / 27-Feb-11
I have a stock internal ka regasketed new headgasket non oem its a 5 layer i think i know its metal. Nis-tuned ecu. RUnning s14 intake manifold, 248/248 cam setup  ca18det turbo running sr injectors and sr fpr. Motors been like that for 2 years in a s13..... Still hasnt poped. And its under 100k miles..... A ka wont pop you know how many ka-t have been on the road for more than a few years... I know a ka-t thats been on the road for  years running a gt3076r.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: BoostedVG on 09:37:08 PM / 27-Feb-11
The ka is a very stout motor even in stock form. Boost it and have fun! good luck with the project and fock nay sayers.
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 01:15:02 PM / 28-Feb-11
Thanks guys! Goos deal. She finally started!! It ran for about 3 seconds and shut off. Hah but thats ok.. It's still not finished. I just wanted to say it started. Haha

Finished the vacuum lines, finished that coolant line, and finished that coil plug. Yay!!
Title: Re: '86 s12 ka24de build
Post by: mrjacobwho on 08:02:14 AM / 07-Jun-11
This is probably one of the longest swaps in history. I've just been working my but off to save up some cash. I picked up a muffler for the guy who's gonna weld on my exhaust. It's a flowmaster 40. bahaha it's definitely going to sound interesting..... After the muffler,  i'm adding a resonator to eliminate a little the growl, make it sound a little less stupid, to say the least. Haha the full exhaust should be done this weekend, leaving me the next weekend or 2 to take it to a shop to finish up whatever it is that I have missed. I've had backyard mechanics offer to take a look at it, but i'm not letting a crackhead touch my baby. Hah whenever it's running, i'll be sure to post a video. This may be one of the cleanest stock s12s out there. :) not bragging, of course.. More soon to come!