Keith's Ca18det Dyno Day (pics&vids)

[sideways_s12]

yes the b16g is awesome ran it on my single slam have one on the wife's dsm and they both took off like a bat outta hell even on stock boost I cant imagine what 21-22 psi feels like keith that thing must haul all kinds of ass lol def way over 211whp if I had to guess I'd say atleast 320-350 for sure. Where are your afr's at?

[Keith]

yes the b16g is awesome ran it on my single slam have one on the wife's dsm and they both took off like a bat outta hell even on stock boost I cant imagine what 21-22 psi feels like keith that thing must haul all kinds of ass lol def way over 211whp if I had to guess I'd say atleast 320-350 for sure. Where are your afr's at?

yeah...I need to get it dynoed....i'm pretty curious.  I'd be very happy with 300whp for sure!  Yeah it pulls like a bat outta hell....especially 4th and 5th...it just keeps going and going....1st and 2nd go by super quick.  AFR's at 21-22 psi are 11.9-12.2. I've only added like 30% across the board on the afc for the Hi thrttle.....so plenty of room to add more to get the afr's down more if I wanted.  I really need to get a tuned chip too

[Kustamogen]

thats my next summers goal.....get some more POWA! not sure with what turbo.....but definitely injectors and a proper safc and wideband are in order......but I want my ca18det to sing like yours!!

[IggyEGuana]

ur on 450cc injectors?  somethin weird goin cuz the injector calc on witch hunter's site says 450s only support 250 hp at 95% duty cycle.  but just looking at ur setup compared to other known builds I would think ur already at 300+.  21psi is many psi.  very yummy psi.  idk maybe ur injectors are bigger or mayb i'm working the calc wrong.  u have the blue top DSM injectors right?

[Keith]

ur on 450cc injectors?  somethin weird goin cuz the injector calc on witch hunter's site says 450s only support 250 hp at 95% duty cycle.  but just looking at ur setup compared to other known builds I would think ur already at 300+.  21psi is many psi.  very yummy psi.  idk maybe ur injectors are bigger or mayb i'm working the calc wrong.  u have the blue top DSM injectors right?

yeah...dsm blue top 450's.  I did just get them cleaned and blueprinted by rc engineering.....not sure if that matters.....but I would think they would support more than 250hp

[sideways_s12]

On the dsm forums they are running more then 250hp with 450's there's guys on there running 300+ on the 450's I read that somewhere but I'll actually ask somone to verify the truth....

[IggyEGuana]

exactly see that sounds right to me.  

just tried the calc again but reduced the Brake Specific Fuel Consumption to what they say is NA level.  says 414cc to reach 300 now.  sounds better.  our motors must not be as thirsty as they think.
try it out.
http://www.witchhunter.com/injectorcalc1.php4

pretty sweet for the other two calcs too

ed: just tried it again.  my 560s will support a lil over 400hp at 95% duty cycle. sweetness

[sideways_s12]

sweet can't wait to put the 450's on mine need to get a knock sensor first lol anyway Keith get that shit to the dyno WE WANNA SEE NUMBERS DAMN IT!!!! My guess is 350 any other guesses.

[IggyEGuana]

at the standard 43.5psi static fuel pressure and 95% duty you'll be limited to about 325 flywheel.  so 300-310 to the wheels plus or minus 10. bump up the static pressure to 55 though and ur 450s become 505s netting you 365 to the flywheel at 95% duty.  so bout 350 indeed lol

all of this is math theory bs anywhay so who knows

can u tell this kind of stuff is interesting to me lol.  interested to see if the B16G has the flow balls to pump out 350 on a CA.  gonna look up the cfm math on that and see if its in the ballpark

[IggyEGuana]

looked up some stuff and figured out the CA's theoretic cfm.  at 21 psi and 8000 rpm it'll flow approx 525cfm.  its commenly accepted (wiki) that the Big 16Gs peak flow while still efficient is 550cfm.  So by the numbers (which are all approximate) you have a killer setup.  Very well matched. BUT, how many ponies is 525cfm u ask? 350! ok ok so its approximate but u gotta admit thats pretty promising.  both the cfm and fueling rates agree ur gonna make 350 horsies. GL and do the CA heads proud

GO DYNO!!!!!!

[sideways_s12]

Lol your such a nerd ...but a car nerd so its cool haha

[Keith]

at the standard 43.5psi static fuel pressure and 95% duty you'll be limited to about 325 flywheel.  so 300-310 to the wheels plus or minus 10. bump up the static pressure to 55 though and ur 450s become 505s netting you 365 to the flywheel at 95% duty.  so bout 350 indeed lol

hmmmm, i'll bump up the static pressure.....thanks

looked up some stuff and figured out the CA's theoretic cfm.  at 21 psi and 8000 rpm it'll flow approx 525cfm.  its commenly accepted (wiki) that the Big 16Gs peak flow while still efficient is 550cfm.  So by the numbers (which are all approximate) you have a killer setup.  Very well matched. BUT, how many ponies is 525cfm u ask? 350! ok ok so its approximate but u gotta admit thats pretty promising.  both the cfm and fueling rates agree ur gonna make 350 horsies. GL and do the CA heads proud

GO DYNO!!!!!!

Wow..that would be flip'in sweet if i hit 350!

I'll start planning a dyno day

[sideways_s12]

ok here's the link to a guy on dsmtuners talking about injectors and fuel pumps hey Iggy since your the mathmatical genius here lol can you decipher this it's jibberish to me

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/tuning-eng...fuel-pumps.html

[IggyEGuana]

^that guy is tryin to compare injectors and fuel pump flow rates to how much air flow they support.  which is good.  kinda sucks he used lbs/min air flow rate instead of cfm but technically that is better cuz it removes density as a variable.  anyway i did some math with his numbers and i'm not sure how he figured those numbers out cuz they dont match the numbers from above and idk whats up with those fuel pump numbers cuz that shit doesnt even make sense.  he's sayin that as boost increases the fuel pump supports less air flow.  uh??  doesnt make sense to me.  hes measuring his air in lbs/min which by definition eliminates boost (density) as a variable. wtf?  if he was measuring his air in cfm then it works so i have to assume he made an error organizing his numbers.  ok so heres a few more numbers

Walbro = 255 liters/hour
450cc x 4 = 1800cc = 108.0 liters/hour
505cc x 4 = 2020cc = 121.2 liters/hour
560cc x 4 = 2240cc = 134.4 liters/hour
630cc x 4 = 2520cc = 151.2 liters/hour (630 is 560 at 55psi)
so no worry of maxxing the walbro out. we could actually be running the smaller walbro 190lph pump

made me curious bout the walbro 255 so
255 liters/hour = 4250 cc/min divided by 4 = 1062.5cc
so 1000cc injectors at 100% duty cycle are pushing near the limit of
the walbro

walbro 190
190 liters/hour = 3166 cc/min divided by 4 = 791.5cc

BUT

there are other flow limitations in any given fuel system.  one big example being the fuel filter.  also just the fuel lines both hard and soft.  and changes in internal diameter and bends also offer resistance to flow (just like an exhaust system eh)

gotta think how much our stock fuel hardlines under the car can flow.  and the stock filter prob doesnt flow a ton either.  but apart from maxing out a walbro i think everything is ok.  could support keith's setup no prob.

oh and all numbers approximate lol
and i dont reccommend maxing out ur fuel system even if it can support it.  always nice to have a ceiling in case of something like a voltage drop or boost spike.

and i'm gonna switch back to the mazda 460s when i finally get a correct ecu that'll work right.  only running 560s to make up for my NA ecu not dumping enough fuel even with safc maxxed.

[sideways_s12]

Ok that clears up some of the questions I had so I guess that's why most fully built dsm's run dual walbros so basically as long as you run duals in a given set-up you would be fine running any size injectors like 1000cc and higher