88 Nissan 200sx 13b Swap

Started by FridayNightHeat, 10:30:11 AM / 03-Jan-09

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FridayNightHeat

I'm getting started on a huge swap a 13b out of my 86 rx7 into my 88 200sx the reason I'm not going with a sr or a rb is I really want to do something different and I really don't have the money to buy a new motor

VG30_S12

good luck man, please keep us posted
1984 Nissan 200sx S12 (FJ20E/KA24DE) its back on bitches >:)
1983 Datsun 280zx megasquirt project (H8FE02)
1996 Jeep Grand Cherokee - Family Hauler/Parts Grabber
"sounds like youve got a serious case of being a WHINY LITTLE BITCH, i'm prescribing you a large dose of MAN THE FUCK UP!!!!"
~friend

seishuku

Glad to see someone finally doing this! DON'T GIVE UP ON IT!
Please?

Good luck!
Matt W.
Daily: 2015 Ecoboost Mustang
Previous Daily: 2011 Camaro V6 (tree fell on it)
Previous previous: 2013 VW Jetta TDI super polluter (got bought back)

JonB

Hey! I'm gonna try that to.

How long before ya get started?

I figure I'm gonna start mine in about a year or so.
http://www.club-s12.org/forums/index.php?s...19062&st=60
^^^^^              ^^^^^^^^              ^^^^^^^^^^^
Here's a link to pics of my 200 and and my rex donor

nismologist

if your gonna go rotary toss a turbo in there.u know we cud fit two 13 bs in our bays anyway so you should have room.

YOU THOUGHT SO, BUT I KNOW SO.
-Macho Man Randy Savage

Draconis

Good Luck.  It will be very interesting to see how this turns out.  I totally agree on the not having to buy a new motor thing.  lol  Anyway, if dont right, you can have an incredible power to weight ratio or a very good balance for front/rear weight.

FridayNightHeat

Im going to start on it next month ill take a lot of pics and keep yall updated and i've got two turbos but i'm not sure if i should use a t2.5 or a t3t4 i think the t2.5 at first and once i get use to the power when i'm drifting ill go up to the t3t4

nismologist

sounds awesome.keep us updated man.

YOU THOUGHT SO, BUT I KNOW SO.
-Macho Man Randy Savage

Draconis

Quote from: FridayNightHeat
Im going to start on it next month ill take a lot of pics and keep yall updated and i've got two turbos but i'm not sure if i should use a t2.5 or a t3t4 i think the t2.5 at first and once i get use to the power when i'm drifting ill go up to the t3t4

I would def. suggest you starting with a T25 first.  The T3/4 may be a bit much.  It depends on where you want your power band to be and what you plan to do with your car.  I dont know that much about rotaries.  I can ask my buddy who has a FC about them or try talking to WankleMonkey/Greg.  He's a big rotary nut.  All I say is if you're tearing a part your car and such, might as well do the apex seals.  I hear they have had these really good aftermarket ones out for a bit now that last longer than the previous options.

FridayNightHeat

Quote from: Draconis
I would def. suggest you starting with a T25 first.  The T3/4 may be a bit much.  It depends on where you want your power band to be and what you plan to do with your car.  I dont know that much about rotaries.  I can ask my buddy who has a FC about them or try talking to WankleMonkey/Greg.  He's a big rotary nut.  All I say is if you're tearing a part your car and such, might as well do the apex seals.  I hear they have had these really good aftermarket ones out for a bit now that last longer than the previous options.


I'm looking to start at about 250hp at the top and when I'm get done I want to have the top 300'shp and I know all about the apex seals there a bitch to change from want I hear I personally  don't know

Draconis

When you change your Apex seals, you are basically tearing a part the motor and rebuilding it.  Also, if you have a T25, it should get you 300hp no probs.  Just do your research on what type of T25 you want and you should be set.

VG30_S12

#11
check out rx7club.com for info on the motor, good resource(or at least it used to be)
with NA, there's little to no chance you'll see 250hp, unless you plan on porting, which will eat gas and decrease overall engine life, and will wreck havoc on your stock ECU(it doesn't like lumpy idle)
with a streetport, you should be able to hit200rwp , but to get any higher than that, you'll need to Bridgeport...

stock NA is fine for now, it'll probably be not much more than a ca18et but much more revy and no torque, afterward you could turbo it(I suguest a good rebuild at the least...)
there's a guy on the RX7Club called ArronCake or something close to that, VERY smart guy, did a 6port Bridgeport on NA rotors, as he has proved, you can turbo an NA, and at low boost, is producing good results... also search on youtube

besides, getting the engine and trans in and everything running will be the most difficult process, getting a TII or a 13B-REW shouldn't be that much harder... more wiring I suppose...

well, I say I'm all for it, but honestly if you don't have the money for a new motor, how do you plan to pull off a complete engine swap to another motor(which requires more time and money than replacing with a Nissan motor) I'm not trying to shit on you or anything, but you have to be realistic when planing something like this...

it'll be interesting to see this should you pull it off...

i also have to ask, i love the S12 and all, but why the hell would you take the 13b out of the car it was designed for and put it in to another car that is heavier, not as balanced and has a really confused suspension with few aftermarket options?
1984 Nissan 200sx S12 (FJ20E/KA24DE) its back on bitches >:)
1983 Datsun 280zx megasquirt project (H8FE02)
1996 Jeep Grand Cherokee - Family Hauler/Parts Grabber
"sounds like youve got a serious case of being a WHINY LITTLE BITCH, i'm prescribing you a large dose of MAN THE FUCK UP!!!!"
~friend

NissanNate

2,390 pounds is what my friends rx7 weighs that's after we just pulled the motor and trany lol.... to say its lighter is kinda far fetched, but it is balanced.  drifting or racing rx7 is definitely not for everyone ether. my friend lances drifts his rx and iv had it side ways a few times. its a totally different animal.  want good power to weight ratio and want to do a extreme swap i say go for it! with the proper exhaust ecu bridge port and tune making 250whp should be possible pretty easily. turbo very very easy. but going n/a would be much easier in my opinion unless you have prior experience with rotaries.  pineapple racing is about as good as you can get for rotary guys they offer some great products to. http://www.pineappleracing.com/index.asp
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frosti108

#13
My unexperienced prediction is that you're gonna blow that little rotary up trying to push the s12 around with it,  

Would be a really cool swap though. I would definatly start looking into cutting the front springs or some other solution to the 'bigger than stock' wheel gap your going to have outfront  

As much as im not a fan of rotaries, I wish u good luck. It should be pretty cool if you actually do it. you wont.
1988 nissan 200sx Se-v6. just a few tweaks, and a welded rear
http://www.youtube.com/user/frosti108

NissanNate

dont say he wont i thinks its very possible. if u get a mega squirt ecu set up, down load maps that people have already used, wire it up with a diyautotune wiring harness and get rid of all the emissions. the swap should go smooth. rebuild the rotary but do not have the rotors honed for 3mm apex seals the 2mm work just as good its a wast of money nomatter what anyone tells you.
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VG30_S12

#15
well, thats also just going on with what ive read(mazda manuals or RX7C)
iirc, the 86 base was around 26-2700lbs, and the heaviest weighed in early 3000lbs which was the S5 TII(leather options and such, also the S5 was a porker to begin with)

using that process, a coupe CA20 and a Base 7 are about equal.... so yeah, your right they are about the same, HOWEVER the big difference would have the be the balance... the suspension on a 7 is better, but id say its still a bit confused

so in terms of weight to power, its should all be not much faster than an NA Base FC(which was the lightest and fastest of the NA)

like i said, im just curious as to why, the only really good benifit i see is that youll have it into an s12, which to me lately has been more comforable and natural than an FC even, oh and the knowledge that you have something that no one else does
1984 Nissan 200sx S12 (FJ20E/KA24DE) its back on bitches >:)
1983 Datsun 280zx megasquirt project (H8FE02)
1996 Jeep Grand Cherokee - Family Hauler/Parts Grabber
"sounds like youve got a serious case of being a WHINY LITTLE BITCH, i'm prescribing you a large dose of MAN THE FUCK UP!!!!"
~friend

NissanNate

Yes but the 13b motor and transmission is probably 150 or so pounds lighter than a ca20e so that helps allot when combined with other weight reduction. probably ending up with  slightly better weight balance as well. I think it could turn out very well.
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VG30_S12

it could, and i hope it turns out better than i'm saying...

i dunno what they are on paper... but i assume that a ka24e is about approximate to a ca20, with that assumption, i've manhandled both from cars, and the 13b weighed considerably more(according to my back anyways)
i could be wrong... as I said it'll be interesting to see what happens

I hear Rotary Avation makes a good seal... when rebuilding, spec out all your parts, as you may not need to replace them all. A basic rebuild, consisting of coolant Orings,oil Orings, and apex seals and springs, and a few other things, will run about $600. more elaborate sets will set you back a little more, but if you don't need it, i wouldn't spend it...

corner seals are more times than not reusable, just check your clearances... side seals are usualy good, if the motor has been properly oiled and kept clean of carbon...

good guide if you've never done it, look for a video by Bruce Taruentine very good and easy to understand

anyways, please keep us posted...
1984 Nissan 200sx S12 (FJ20E/KA24DE) its back on bitches >:)
1983 Datsun 280zx megasquirt project (H8FE02)
1996 Jeep Grand Cherokee - Family Hauler/Parts Grabber
"sounds like youve got a serious case of being a WHINY LITTLE BITCH, i'm prescribing you a large dose of MAN THE FUCK UP!!!!"
~friend

FridayNightHeat

Quote from: VG30_S12
check out rx7club.com for info on the motor, good resource(or at least it used to be)
with NA, there's little to no chance you'll see 250hp, unless you plan on porting, which will eat gas and decrease overall engine life, and will wreck havoc on your stock ECU(it doesn't like lumpy idle)
with a streetport, you should be able to hit200rwp , but to get any higher than that, you'll need to Bridgeport...

stock NA is fine for now, it'll probably be not much more than a ca18et but much more revy and no torque, afterward you could turbo it(I suguest a good rebuild at the least...)
there's a guy on the RX7Club called ArronCake or something close to that, VERY smart guy, did a 6port Bridgeport on NA rotors, as he has proved, you can turbo an NA, and at low boost, is producing good results... also search on youtube

besides, getting the engine and trans in and everything running will be the most difficult process, getting a TII or a 13B-REW shouldn't be that much harder... more wiring I suppose...

well, I say I'm all for it, but honestly if you don't have the money for a new motor, how do you plan to pull off a complete engine swap to another motor(which requires more time and money than replacing with a Nissan motor) I'm not trying to shit on you or anything, but you have to be realistic when planing something like this...

it'll be interesting to see this should you pull it off...

i also have to ask, i love the S12 and all, but why the hell would you take the 13b out of the car it was designed for and put it in to another car that is heavier, not as balanced and has a really confused suspension with few aftermarket options?


well  I have a fc so I already have almost everything I need for the swap. The only reason I'm not keeping the engine and just building the fc is I don't have a title and the person I got the car from past after I got the car from them and they gave me the wrong title so I really can use the car so after I use what I need I'm parting out the car


Quote from: NissanNate
Yes but the 13b motor and transmission is probably 150 or so pounds lighter than a ca20e so that helps allot when combined with other weight reduction. probably ending up with  slightly better weight balance as well. I think it could turn out very well.


yeah I'm going to strip everything from the back of the front seats out of the car and I'm putting some light weight seats, and wheels when money gets up

NissanNate

#19
well i say go for it balls out!!! look up mega squirt ecu's, and installation on 13b. for the easiest install your going to want to remove all the emissions, make a electronic solenoid action for the 5th & 6th port operation, and use a stand alone ecu like mega squirt. the great thing about mega squirt is the simplicity and cleanliness of it.( free maps online from other users & huge online support) by doing these the swap will only require mounts. and fitment will become easier. I also advise removing the oil injection system and running mixed gas.  

best mega squirt site is http://www.diyautotune.com/
you can also purchase complete wiring harnesses, sensors and even gauges from them including a 5" touch screen display and interface. All at extremely great prices.

good luck ask if you have any questions
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