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Author Topic: wont run for more than a few seconds  (Read 4128 times)

Offline diego94

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wont run for more than a few seconds
« on: 03:15:48 PM / 23-Oct-13 »
I have just gotten my first s12, it is a 87 CA20E auto that has been sitting for 3 years...I have minimal mechanical knowledge so bear with me

the po told me it had been very reliable up until it was parked, the problem was that it would die at odd intervals that could be hours to weeks apart and then not start back up,,, then the next day it would be fine so he thought it was the fuel pump..

the fuel pump was good however I found multiple shorts from the wires simply being old to the last person to have worked on it being a moron, all wire connections were hardly together without solder or even tape and it was just left as a rats nest for years... so I fixed the shorts and now the pump runs fine however dosnt turn off when the ignition is tuned off( I saw a thread on that already somewhere on here)...

so the car will turn on right away but then turn off within 2-10 seconds, the fuel pump is a bit loud and having pulled it earlier I assmed there was air in the system so wile it was running I opened the return fuel line till it had a conssistend flow and that seemed to help but only a little( I blead it behind the intake manifold right where the hard line turns to soft line)...

what I think it could be is that there is still air in the system and that I need a better way to get it out or possibly my timing is off, if someone could give me some help it would be appreciated, im not new to forums and I am still doing my research.

thx

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Offline Slideways87Panda

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #1 on: 02:01:15 PM / 24-Oct-13 »
try plugs wire cap rotor, make sure they give you the right cap tho 84 to 86.5 is different then 86.5 to 88, get a junkyard s13 fuel pump and change the oil also check the timing it differs from the years above, hope this helps
"The important thing is to keep trying"
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Offline diego94

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #2 on: 12:12:07 AM / 25-Oct-13 »
ya I was starting consider electrical cause im pretty sure the air is out of the system, I mixed the plug wires up ounce on my Cherokee the same weekend I did some transmission work on it and the sound of it backfiring to me sounded like tranny clunking lol (I was in drivers seat and didn't have someone to stand behind and listen). as for jy parts iv never actually seen another 200xs of any series around, not that I was looking for them before (first Nissan im kinda a 4x4 guy  :grinwink: ) but I know all the local jy's and right off the top I know mine is the only one for a long ways, there is a spare cap I found in the back when I got it though just haven't looked at it, when none of this works il rip into it n check the timing but in the mean time im away this weekend so I wont have a chance to look at it till Monday.

thx

Offline sideways_s12

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #3 on: 02:20:24 AM / 25-Oct-13 »
 check the codes on the ecu  it'll help you  find your problem.

Offline cellblockd

Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #4 on: 02:43:04 PM / 25-Oct-13 »
The ca20e is also a mega nightmare for vacuum issues.. Check all the hoses and tubes going to the aac valve , hell just check all of them to be sure.. That shit is what made me start the swap I'm working on.. And the ca20e isn't worth trying to make run decent unless you making a Franken ca with parts from the ca18det to boost the crap out of. 

Offline Prolowtone

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #5 on: 06:21:26 PM / 25-Oct-13 »
make sure you have all the connectors hooked up, mine did a similar thing after i refreshed the head of my ca20. forgot to connect the MAF and something else...
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Offline diego94

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #6 on: 03:19:43 PM / 02-Nov-13 »
ok so all electrical connections checked out, only found a few odd things, one of the ignition coils wasn't connected to the dis cap and it needed a new fuel pump relay... after that it was just scrubing the shit outa the spark plugs, one plug wire was toast and so was another plug and wile I was in there I cranked it with the plugs out and litteraly shit flew from every plug hole, after this it runs much better however wont idle, above 1500rpm its fine but below it dies, I raised the idle a bit on the throttle body adjuster but not on the cpu adjuster but only helped a little.

what I think the prob is now is the thing I cant remember the name of attached to the air filter box with the little trap door in it (vac problem?). or mabey an injector isn't working to the full (leaning towards the previous cause it runs great on higher rpm just problem on the idling)

Offline Slideways87Panda

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #7 on: 01:31:19 PM / 03-Nov-13 »
try a cap and rotor and are you talking about the flap door on the maf ?
"The important thing is to keep trying"
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Offline diego94

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #8 on: 03:48:48 PM / 03-Nov-13 »
cap looks like it coulda been new before it was parked, rotors not bad but could be replaced,

yes that is the part I was thinking of, the trap door is a little sticky when its on

Offline IggyEGuana

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #9 on: 12:01:39 AM / 04-Nov-13 »
that trap door is the ca20's version of a maf. if its sticking you can clean it and even lightly lube where the hinge is. also find the idle speed adjuster and thread it outward a bit so it lets more air thru. also check the timing with a timing light. spec on a ca20 auto is a pathetic 4 degrees btdc. dont be afraid to crank it up to 10-15 btdc or more if you run premium gas. when you check the timing you might find that its either waaay retarded or waaay advanced. that would be from the distributor being installed a tooth off. I restab my dizzy by putting the motor at tdc and unscrewing the cap off the dizzy with the wires still on the cap. pretty easy to see from there how to get the rotor prong to line up with where intake side #1 on the cap would be. you also might want to check your fuel pressure since you had a fuel pump issue. just to rule that out.

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Offline diego94

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #10 on: 12:13:56 AM / 05-Nov-13 »
i didn't have much time for it today as its in a field where I work but I had gotten a new air filter for it as the one I had was from a different car and didn't fit or seal at all, I gave the trap door some wd40 and as I was looking at it I spotted a unconnected vacuum hose... I reconnected it and rushed back to work. now I havnt had a chance to see how this affected it because I was too busy and I broke a spark plug (not in the engine) so im just going t go get new plugs an then I will be able to test how the vacuum leak now sealed affects it.

now I don't know what the particular vacuum line was for or where it went and I was in a rush so I didn't bother to look (it was off the air intake the last line from the manifold literally an inch or to from the intake line to the manifold) if that helps.

so after I get new plugs I will see how it idles and go from there. well im hoping that was it but im ready to check the timing if this dosnt do it.

I did adjust the idle screw and nut on the throttle body and purposely put it higher than I thought it needed to go, it starts to die below 1000-1500 rpm..

Offline sideways_s12

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #11 on: 11:17:22 PM / 10-Nov-13 »
Did you check the codes?

Offline diego94

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #12 on: 02:32:12 PM / 16-Nov-13 »
last week I got a new plug to replace the snaped one, and tested it with the vacuum line connected, idled great!!!! however the battery I got was given to me and its condition is questionable, I have no charger so when im working on the car I simply hook it up to my jeep... now when I disconnect the jeep it dies, I had the 2 hooked up to charge the batt for about 20 min both running, I disconnected them to move the jeep to finally drive the Nissan and in the 2 or 3 min for me to move the jeep and clean up my tools it died... didn't die right away it deffinetly took 2 or 3 min...

iv been really busy recently and havnt worked on it since last time I posted on here about a week ago, I got a new job and due to money problems iv been sleeping in my jeep in the next town close to work.. so im not sure when I will have time to work on it next... but its either my questionable batt or alt but I am thus far pleased with how it runs when its got the jeep hooked up and have faith the next time I work on it it will move on its own all the way to my house    :nerdystraight:

now I havnt checked for any codes as its in a field and I don't have anything to check it with.. Canadian tire has obd1 and 2 scanners on sale for $200 right now and I wanted one a wile ago but didn't have the money,, I havnt done any research at all on the ecu I don't know if its obd1 or something else.. this is my first time on a computer since my last post so my research is slow or non exsistent.

it might be another week or so before I post again sorry for my slowness

Offline IggyEGuana

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #13 on: 08:27:58 PM / 16-Nov-13 »
if you have any type of voltage meter check the battery with the engine off and engine running. roughly 12.5v off and 14.5v running. if your alt is bad/poorly connected and your batt is dead/poorly connected then that would explain the car dying. Not enough voltage to produce spark energy at the coil

checking codes isnt likely to tell you much. But if you really want to do it just check the FSM (factory service manual) for the procedure and what the codes mean. No special scan tool required

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Offline diego94

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #14 on: 09:42:52 PM / 20-Nov-13 »
already checked it with a meter before, I know for sure its one or the other but the bat being so questionable I simply cant tell.

I thought I needed some thing that plugs into the cpu to give me the codes? like I said I still havnt looked into it as there are no idiot lights on the dash flashing so it hasn't been on my urgent list, but its been recommended and it wouldn't hurt when I get the time..

gonna try n move it on fri I think, and have a friend follow me with my jeep, thinking if I just keep the revs up il be fine, from there it will prob sit till spring when I hopfully have money to fix all bugs n get it going reliably to drive when snow melts

Offline rednucleus

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #15 on: 01:33:55 PM / 21-Nov-13 »
Before you spend money on ANYTHING else, please get to EBay and get this FSM. It is an essential tool and time saver. Take it from somone that didn't have one for 25 years!! You will find a section that tells you how to read your codes from flashing lights on your ecu. No other instrument needed.       
Good luck getting this book!
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http://www.ebay.com/itm/1987-NISSAN-200SX-ORIGINAL-FACTORY-SERVICE-MANUAL-SHOP-REPAIR-/360793809305?pt=Motors_Manuals_Literature&vxp=mtr&hash=item5400fca199&forcev4exp=true

Offline IggyEGuana

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #16 on: 07:44:50 PM / 21-Nov-13 »
^what he said

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Offline diego94

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #17 on: 09:44:44 PM / 21-Nov-13 »
oh don't worry I go one but mines more current, I don't know what years mine covers but it includes 87 for sure and also equal years of stanza's and 240sx's.. no I misunderstood and was expecting to need a scan tool like slightly more modern cars,, I hadn't know that this Nissan was before that....

also to be clear all iv got into this car is $20 in gas in the tank, a can of seafoam that has yet to go in it and a single spark pluge... all my problems have been tracking down electrical shorts from corroded wires, vacume leaks, replacing fuses, cleaning electrical crap, scraping crude off of spark plugs, spraying wd40 on things supposed to move that arnt and duct taping things that move but arnt supposed to. the car was also in a fender bender and the passenger side headlight wouldn't come up cause of bent brakets and iv just been bending that back to... the second ignition coil wire that I was missing I fixed by borrowing another spark plug wire from a Honda that was going to get scraped and the batt I got was given to me.. I have yet to spend on parts other than my single spark plug.

Offline IggyEGuana

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #18 on: 11:27:34 PM / 21-Nov-13 »
thats good. just a heads up though, the factory service manual and the haynes/chiltons manual you have are NOT the same thing. The FSM is a service manual published by Nissan themselves. its FAR FAR FAR superior to a haynes or whatever manuall in every possible way. Trust us and get a FSM for your year. Good luck

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Offline rednucleus

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Re: wont run for more than a few seconds
« Reply #19 on: 11:46:14 PM / 21-Nov-13 »
^what he said lol!!